"Baby parts! Get yer baby parts! On sale at Planned Parenthood!"

David:

Well, well.  It has certainly hit the fan, now.  Planned Parenthood making sure they don't damage the (sellable) goods when they crush a baby's head. Looks like someone's secrets are now out in the open. (Unlike Hillary's email server).

It's kind of hard to make the case you're serving the best interest of women, when you make no references to the welfare of women, but you do talk about making sure you get enough cash to get your Lamborghini.

Doug:

You must be referring to the hoax video that is out, right? I think that has largely been debunked. If you think you can get a "body part" for $30, then you don't know the going rate on the black market very well.

David:

Hmmm.  Hillary is "very disturbed" by the video. And the president of Planned Parenthood has apologized for the tone of her remarks. Seems like they wouldn't need to comment if the video was a "hoax".  But if you get all of your news from the Huffington Post, then you probably do think it's all a right-wing hoax.

Doug:

Well, then, I think we can both agree that the video has had its intended effect. Nothing else left to see here; move along.

David:

Yes, I can see that you, along with the rest of the pro-abortion community would rather just shout "War on Women", than actually discuss what is going on here. I note that Hillary (like a typical politician) initially said that the video was just an attempt by Republicans to "deny a woman's right to have an abortion". After the third video was released, she had modified that statement to,  “Planned Parenthood for more than a century has done a lot of really good work for women — cancer screenings, family planning, all kinds of health services. And this raises not questions about Planned Parenthood so much as it raises questions about the whole process, that is, not just involving Planned Parenthood, but many institutions in our country.” That's not quite the firm denial of the videos she first claimed. In fact, she seemed to say a whole lot, without actually saying anything. Now, she says that people have to "change their religious beliefs" so that more babies can have their heads crushed, but not their valuable human parts. Seriously?

When there is no defense, the best move is just to try to pretend like the video is false, and there is nothing real to discuss here. That seems to be your argument. Please, please, please, just move along...

Doug:

Ok, I guess I was wrong... there is something to discuss here, but doesn't seem to have much to do with the video. 

For the first time, I have to say that I find your term "pro-abortion community" truly hurtful. No one wants to have to have an abortion. Things happen, and many women have to decide between terrible alternatives. When you are 16 years old, having a baby can destroy your life. I know that that might not be a choice for you, but it is for many women, and it can save their lives in more than one way... many women that you know have had to make this choice. It isn't called "pro-choice" because of some Political Correct commandment... it is called that because that is what it is about... the choice to have to make this decision in terrible circumstances.

Once you have had an abortion, it seems that donating anything useful to help someone...anyone, is an easy choice. The video is a very well edited piece to make it look like Planned Parenthood sells body parts. But that isn't so. They do need to pay for shipping of these tissues, and that is what is being discussed. 

I don't care too much how any presidential candidate attempts to figure out how to deal with the hoax. I don't think it leads to any great insight into their political views. And that is why I suggested that there isn't much here to see.

David:

Getting pregnant is not like getting cancer. It isn't something that just happens to people. You wake up one morning, and, hey, you're pregnant.

I am fully in favor of empowering young women to choose not to get pregnant. But once you make the choice to have unprotected sex, and you become pregnant, both parents have the responsibility to care for the baby they have created. No one has to have to have an abortion. Being pro-choice really means that you are in favor of eliminating a child that is inconvenient. And before you poo poo that comment, the vast majority of abortions in this country are for just that reason.....convenience.

Doug:

Which is completely legal.

David:

You may say that the videos (which are available unedited, just so people can't say they are manipulated via clever editing) describe processing fees, but their medical director notes that the price is variable. "Let's say $100, but I'll have to check around to see what other people are getting." Then, she goes on to say she wants to make money, and wants the Lamborghini. Not something you'd expect someone to say if they were only charging a standard shipping rate.

I think society has taken a bad turn, when we accept the idea that it's a good thing to destroy children to make our adult lives better. I'll have to eliminate a baby, by having it's head crushed, but I'll get a new liver out of it, so it's all good. You call it "tissues", but it's really human body parts, fully developed and functioning. And that's because they come from real people.

Doug:

Obviously you see this issue completely differently---not only from me, most of the women in the world, but the supreme court as well. Women have a choice, and that is the law. In addition, the hoax video doesn't help your argument. Even your own Governor Mike Pence has found nothing wrong here.

 

David:

The issue here is not whether abortion is legal. The issue is whether Planned Parenthood is illegally making a profit by selling baby parts. The videos certainly offer (at a minimum) circumstantial evidence that they are. It is also against federal law to alter the abortion procedure just to prevent damaging certain organs to be used in research or to be sold. The videos conclusively show that Planned Parenthood changes their procedures based on what pieces of the baby are being "harvested".

 

Doug:

I think society has taken a great turn, by allowing women to have control over their lives.

On this issue, I think we will have to agree to disagree.